Mike,

Thank you once again for your typical prompt and wonderful reply. And thanks a million for pointing out Eph 2:11-16. I really don’t know how they can reason their way around that one to believe in two administrations, but I’m sure they’ll give it the old college try. And I already did cite Rom 2:28-29; Rom 9:8 and Gal 3:29 … all to no avail of course. The natural mind just cannot comprehend spiritual things like Paul said.
Anyway, I thought you might be interested to know that I posted your email segment on Ephesians two along with this:
No, I do not see the ‘whole’ of Jewish Israel as God’s chosen people, by reason of those scriptures I cited in my previous comment. God’s promises are only for a remnant, those who suffered to obtain a better resurrection (Heb 11:35); these are God’s chosen people.

Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

Was David led by the Spirit? What about Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Elijah, Elisha, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Joel and Zechariah? Were these men all led by the Spirit? If so, then Paul seems to imply that they are indeed SONS of God. So can one be both a Bride AND a Son at the same time? Paul seems to think so. In his second letter to the church at Corinth, the majority of whom were undoubtedly GENTILE believers, Paul wrote:

2Co 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a CHASTE VIRGIN to Christ.

And yes, God will most definitely fulfill His plan for the world, but it won’t be via the physical, Christ- rejecting Jewish nation of Israel, but rather via SPIRITUAL Israel: these chosen few OT saints including the NT saints of course (Rom 8:19). True, all Israel will be saved, but not until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in (Eze 16:55; Rom 11:25). And this won’t occur until AFTER the 1000 years (Rev 20:5 a).
Thanks again, my brother,
G____

Hi G____,

You have given those brothers a witness, and that is all you can do.
Of course the Romans were a basically Gentile church because Paul tells us so in the first chapter (Rom 1:13). Then he tells these same Gentile converts what you reminded your friends of in chapter 9:

Rom 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Who are these “children of promise”? Are they physical Israelites? Here is Paul’s answer in writing to another church full of Gentile converts:

Gal 4:28 Now we, brethren [ Gentile Galatians], as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

What does it mean to be “Abraham’s seed”? Here is the answer according to the apostle these Concordant brothers profess to believe:

Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Can one not be a Gentile and be Christ’s? These words are written to Gentile Galatians who were no longer Gentiles and who were no longer uncircumcision in spirit, but are rather spiritually circumcised and are now spiritually Abraham’s seed.

Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

I need to take exception with what you say here concerning the timing of the salvation of the Old Testament saints. You said:

And yes, God will most definitely fulfill His plan for the world, but it won’t be via the physical, Christ- rejecting Jewish nation of Israel, but rather via SPIRITUAL Israel: these chosen few OT saints including the NT saints of course (Rom 8:19)

Concerning the status of all the Old Testaments saints and men of God, Christ made this statement:

Mat 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.

So according to Christ, “Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Elijah, Elisha, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Joel and Zechariah”, who were all “born of women” will not be as great as “he that is least in the kingdom of God”. The only way it is possible for John and all of the Old Testament men of God to be less than the least in the kingdom of God, is for them not to be in that kingdom and to be raised up after that kingdom as spirits to have all their Old Testament doctrines burned out of them in a symbolic ‘lake of fire’ and to be introduced, for the first time, to the only ‘name… under heaven… whereby we must be saved’.

Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

That ‘name’ is Christ’s character and His gospel, which simply was never revealed until after He came to reveal it.
Christ tells us that it was “expedient” that He go away. Why so? If the Old Testament saints can be saved before He came, then why does He need to “go away”? The answer He gives us is that ‘If I go not away the holy spirit cannot come’.

Joh 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

If the holy spirit had already come to the Old Testament saints, then Christ’s coming would have been unnecessary. But we know better than that. So we are specifically told that the Old Testament men of faith “received not the promises”. Why didn’t they receive the promises? Simply because God had “something better for us” and not, at this time, for the Old Testament saints and men of faith.

Heb 11:39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
Heb 11:40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

Those are the last two verse of Heb 11, the so called “faith chapter” of scripture. That chapter mentions even more of the Old Testament ‘men of faith’ than are on your list.
Lest we think those verses are simply telling us that the Old Testament saints and men of faith will have to wait with us till the first resurrection, this is all super clarified by Peter who tells us unequivocally that concerning “the salvation of our souls… they were not ministering to themselves [ at all] but unto us”.

1Pe 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
1Pe 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:
1Pe 1:11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.
1Pe 1:12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

Paul had already made this clear by telling us that “the ends of the ages” had not come upon ancient Israel, but “upon” us.

1Co 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world [ Greek – aions, ages] are come.

After telling us that the person who is least in the kingdom of God will be greater than all the men of God of the Old Testament, Christ reiterates this fact in making this statement to His disciples who had just asked Him why He taught the multitudes in parables (Mat 13:10-15):

Mat 13:17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

Here is just how crucial is the body of Christ to the salvation of all men. God’s elect are the channel for the salvation of all men. All men of the New Testament and all men of the Old Testament will ‘obtain mercy’ through us:

Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.

Joseph’s mercy shown to his brothers is the type of the mercy we will show the physical seed of Abraham, as well as those who claim to be Abraham’s spiritual seed in the New Testament, but are not because they have no room in them for Christ’s Words (Joh 8:37). Joseph is the type of God’s New Testament church, His elect, by whom He will make known His entire plan for all mankind of all time:

Eph 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
Eph 3:10 To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:
Joh 8:37 I know that ye are Abraham’s seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you.

“By the church” these mysteries will be made known to all. When we see things like this we should be humbled by what God has revealed that He has in store for His elect, and which He has hidden from the world:

1Co 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
1Co 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
1Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
1Co 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

Speaking of those “deep things of God” immediately after informing us that we, the New Testament saints and elect, are God’s channel for His mercy to be given to all men of all time, he exclaims:

Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
Rom 11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
Rom 11:35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
Rom 11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.

I hope this helps to give you a better understanding of the mind of God on this subject concerning the salvation of the Patriarchs and the great men of faith who served God before and during the time of John the Baptist. Peter mentions “the spirit of Christ which was in them”, but it was only “in them” in the same sense it was in Samson and in King David, who died with revenge on his mind and in his heart.

Jdg 13:25 And the Spirit of the LORD began to move him [ Samson] at times in the camp of Dan between Zorah and Eshtaol.
Psa 51:11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me.
1Ki 2:5 Moreover thou knowest also what Joab the son of Zeruiah did to me, and what he did to the two captains of the hosts of Israel, unto Abner the son of Ner, and unto Amasa the son of Jether, whom he slew, and shed the blood of war in peace, and put the blood of war upon his girdle that was about his loins, and in his shoes that were on his feet.
1Ki 2:6 Do therefore according to thy wisdom, and let not his hoar head go down to the grave in peace.

Your brother in Christ,
Mike