Mike,

I have just read your most recent study article on the “great multitude which no one can number”. I have never heard anyone equate the “great crowd” (JW- speak) to the seed of the bondwoman. I am in shock that I (and several million Jehovah’s Witnesses) could see these people as those who survive Armageddon (as non- elect) and live peacefully on earth for the 1000- year reign of Jesus and the 144,000. I am sure that I will re- read this article and associated scriptures several times to deepen my understanding.
Unfortunately, this does bring to another critical question. Perhaps my “end- times”, dispensation- oriented brain is still missing the point on something… I don’t know. Your wisdom would be appreciated… but I have to ask…
Who… who, pray tell, are the 144,000 going to be reigning over? Presumably those living on the earth. Who are those people going to be? I was always taught that those would be the “great multitude, which no man could number” (Great Crowd). Perhaps your further studies in the book of Revelation will garner some insight on this, but I wonder if you might provide a morsel for me to study/ pray about.
Obviously, I am having a hard time seeing that Revelation strictly has an inward application.  It seems some of your writings seem to indicate that there is some dispensational nature to at least some of the book… which parts?

Thank you.
T____

Hi Tim,

I appreciate you sharing your story with me, and I am very gratified that the Lord is opening your eyes to see the things that are taught in the scriptures “not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the holy spirit teaches comparing spiritual things with spiritual” (1Co 2:13-14).
If the holy spirit used words as man’s wisdom uses them, then we could all get a good dictionary and a complete concordance and understand everything in God’s Word. But such is not the case.

1Co 2:13  Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
1Co 2:14  But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Spiritual things are expressed in parables, shadows and types, but not in words which man’s wisdom teaches.
In Rev 7 the “great multitude which no man could number has come up through great tribulation and has washed their robes white in the blood of the lamb.” That is the only way to get into the city or to come to God. Christ Himself came up through great tribulation, and washed His robes white in His own blood.

Luk 22:42  Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.
Luk 22:43  And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him.
Luk 22:44  And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground.

So sure enough, Christ’s word’s do not pass away, and they will be just as true and as applicable to those in the lake of fire as they are to those in the first resurrection. Those in the first resurrection will rule those in the millennium with a rod of iron, and then they will rule the great multitude which no man can number in the lake of fire where Sodom and Samaria will be resurrected and brought into the city of God.
This is all spiritual. It is true in every generation, and it is true for every man.

1Co 3:13  Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is.
1Co 3:14  If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15  If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

Every man that is ever saved will be saved by fire. That is what Paul says here, that is what Christ says here:

Mar 9:49  For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.

Those in the first resurrection are no exception to this “every one shall be salted with fire… Every man will be saved by fire” rule.

1Pe 4:12  Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:

The only difference is the timing of this fiery trial. For God’s elect, today is judgment day, and today is when these “fiery trials” are doing their purifying work. It is right here in this same 4th chapter of 1 Peter.

1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
1Pe 4:18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

Peter was asking a rhetorical question. He knew exactly where they would appear to be saved.

2Pe 3:9  The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us- ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Peter knew very well that every sacrifice would be salted with fire. He knew that Christ had deliberately hidden the mysteries of the kingdom from the multitudes, and Peter knew that God would not allow any to perish, but would save them all through the agency of fire, the lake of fire.
Finally, this is what happens to those who live through the millennium.

Rev 20:7  And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8  And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom [ is] as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9  And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Those who live during the millennium are deceived and devoured by fire. How does that fit into these verses concerning the “great multitude which no man can number?”

Rev 7:9  After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Rev 7:13  And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Rev 7:14  And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Rev 7:15  Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.
Rev 7:16  They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat.
Rev 7:17  For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

How can anyone say that those who are deceived and devoured and cast into the lake of fire are those being spoken of in Rev 7:10-17, unless they have come out of the lake of fire, and with Sodom and Samaria, are salted with and saved by fire, just as are those who are in that blessed and holy first resurrection?

Rev 20:6  Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

This is the “high calling” of which Paul speaks:

Php 3:14  I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.

Now look at what happens in the very next verse of Rev 20.

Rev 20:10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [ are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Rev 20:11  And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12  And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is [ the book] of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13  And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
Rev 20:14  And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15  And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

All who are not in that “blessed and holy first resurrection, are cast into the lake of fire and are judged according to their works. What happens when we are judged? Here is what happens to all those who lived during the millennium and all those who lived before Christ and all who have lived since Christ but were not part of the “judgment which is now on the house of God” (1Pe 4:17).

1Co 11:31  For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.
1Co 11:32  But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be condemned [ to the great white throne judgement] with the world.

But it is a “white throne.” It is the throne of the pure and just and loving Lamb who is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world, and not just for those in that “blessed and holy first resurrection.”

1Jn 2:2  And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

That great white throne judgment is the great tribulation through which the great multitude which no man can number comes. It is in that judgment that their robes are washed white in the blood of the Lamb, just as ours are being washed while we are “first being judged by fiery trials” (1Pe 4:12, 17).
You have asked “who, pray tell, do the 144,000 rule over during the millennium?” They rule over those who were not resurrected or “changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye” at the coming of Christ for His few elect who are now being judged and have been being judged in every generation since Christ. The 144,000 rule over those who live on into the millennium and end up being deceived and devoured by the fire that comes down from God out of heaven. The 144,000 blessed and holy participants of that blessed and holy first resurrection also judge men and angels in the lake of fire simply because the fire of that lake is in their mouths.

Jer 5:14  Wherefore thus saith the LORD God of hosts, Because ye speak this word, behold, I will make my words in thy mouth fire, and this people wood, and it shall devour them.

These words will never pass away, and they will be just as applicable in the lake of fire as they were the day they were written and as they are today in the mouths of God’s true witnesses.

Rev 11:3  And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred [ and] threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4  These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
Rev 11:5  And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.

When I show you Ezekiel 16:55 and Rev 20:10-15 and you see that the millenialists are all cast into the lake of fire, those words will come from the mouths of the elect and devour all the false doctrines of the Watchtower Society. There is not one verse of support for the doctrine that those who live in the flesh during the millennium are the great multitude which no man can number. There are only two resurrections and, contrary to the false doctrine of the Watchtower Society that those who live into the millennium are the great multitude who will live forever in the flesh on earth, there is no such thing as eternal flesh in the kingdom of God.

1Co 15:50  Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

All in Adam will be made a living spirit in due time:

1Co 15:44  It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
1Co 15:45  And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1Co 15:46  Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
1Co 15:47  The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
1Co 15:48  As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as [ is] the heavenly, such [ are] they also that are heavenly.
1Co 15:49  And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

Yes, you are struggling to learn from the spiritual words that are God’s Word. You are struggling to learn that “the holy spirit teaches comparing spiritual things with spiritual.”
I pray this helps you to understand who the 144,000 reign over during the millennium are and to see that those who live during the millennium are deceived and devoured and cast into the lake of fire, to “come up through great tribulation” just as we are experiencing at this time in these vessels of clay. When it is all said and done, even the Watchtower Society will have to acknowledge the truth of these verses of God’s word.

Ecc 9:2  All things come alike to all: there is one event to the righteous, and to the wicked; to the good and to the clean, and to the unclean; to him that sacrificeth, and to him that sacrificeth not: as is the good, so is the sinner; and he that sweareth, as he that feareth an oath.
Ecc 9:3  This is an evil among all things that are done under the sun, that there is one event unto all: yea, also the heart of the sons of men is full of evil, and madness is in their heart while they live, and after that they go to the dead.

That one event is:

Mar 9:49  For every one shall be salted with fire, and every sacrifice shall be salted with salt.

Those words will not pass away.

Mat 24:33  So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
Mat 24:34  Verily I say unto you, This generation [ every generation reading these words, including each and every generation since Christ] shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. [ in those to whom it is given to see and hear the mysteries of the kingdom of God].
Mat 24:35  Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

Your brother in Christ,
Mike