Tartaroo And The Bottomless Pit
Hi Mike,
I hope everything is going well. I have a friend who believes the sons of God are fallen angels who had intercourse with the daughters of men. I have read all your writings on the subject and it’s clear to me these verses of scripture are not saying that. I have had a talk with him about this, and I am concerned about his spiritual state. This belief has also led him to believe that Satan had intercourse with Eve and Cain is his Child. It appears I need to strengthen my understanding to help him and was praying you could answer some of his points I wasn’t able to.
1) In 2Pe 2:4 he says the word is tartaroo not hades or gehenna. He feels this is where these angels are that left their first estate by fornicating with these women and men go to hades therefore this is referring to spirit angels.
2) He feels the giants in Gen 6, Num 13 and Kings are the result of these angels fornicating with the daughters of men, and since God chained them up in tartaroo because they left their first estate, they can’t do this anymore, and that’s why the giants died out.
3) He says Mat 22:30 supports his beliefs by saying this is how they should be, but they left that state and were thus punished for it . He adds that the men of Sodom were going to fornicate with the men in Lot’s house, so this proves the angels can have intercourse; they’re just not supposed to.
It seems to me a guy named Arnold Murray teaches all this and it’s becoming a quite popular teaching lately. Like I said I read all your work before I wrote this email. I see the word malak can mean messengers and not just spirits and the spirits in prison are just the souls in prison in the days of Noah who had the truth preached to them by Noah preparing the ark. However I was hoping you could help me with these few points above. I’m not quite sure how to respond to them and am very concerned for this person. I will greatly appreciate any help.
Your Brother in Christ,
M____
Hi M____,
Thanks for your question.
The first thing I would say is that you need not be overly concerned for the spiritual welfare of your friend. He is exactly where the Lord has him, and when it comes time for your friend to see the truth of God’s Word, nothing in the world will be able to keep that from happening. On the other hand, until The Lord drags your friend to Himself, nothing you say or do will prepare his heart to receive God’s Word.
Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw [ Greek, drag] him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
Cain certainly was the seed of the serpent, because the Bible tells us that he was “of that wicked one.”
1Jn 3:12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother’s righteous.
But it is absolutely absurd to suggest that this was the result of physical sexual intercourse, when the scriptures tell us plainly that Cain was conceived of Adam and Eve, not Satan and Eve:
Gen 4:1 And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the LORD.
It was Christ Himself who told Eve that her seed would be both of Satan and of God:
Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife’s name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.
Eve is the mother of all living. That even includes Christ. Even Christ was “made of a woman.”
Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
But Adam is the Father of all living, as this verse shows:
1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
All who die do so “in Adam.” This too, includes Christ and His body of flesh. All who have or ever will live will be born are born “in Adam.” That is what the scriptures teach. There is no basis in scripture for women having physical sex with angels. The men of Sodom found out just how likely that is. Using the perverted desires of men as proof that the word of God contradicts itself is simply no way to handle God’s Word. God Words are not just true today, but untrue tomorrow. This is, was and will be the truth concerning spirit beings as messengers of God:
Mat 22:28 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her.
Mat 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.
Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
“The angels of God in heaven… neither marry nor are given in marriage.” The messengers who left their first estate were the descendants of Seth who were to keep themselves separate from Cain’s children, just as Israel was told to keep themselves pure and separated from the nations around them:
Deu 7:2 And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; thou shalt smite them, [ and] utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor shew mercy unto them:
Deu 7:3 Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son.
Deu 7:4 For they will turn away thy son from following me, that they may serve other gods: so will the anger of the LORD be kindled against you, and destroy thee suddenly.
But by the time of the flood, Noah’s was the only family on earth which had not married into the families of those who were “of that wicked one.” That is what this verse is telling us:
Gen 6:9 These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.
Just like ancient Israel, Seth’s descendants had ignored God’s commandment to keep themselves free from the influences of the pagans around them. They had married into “the sons of God” and had brought God’s wrath down upon themselves. At that time all the sons of men, just like ancient Israel, were nothing more than “spirits in prison.”
Isa 42:6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;
Isa 42:7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, [ and] them that sit in darkness out of the prison house.
Isa 42:8 I [ am] the LORD: that [ is] my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
The spirits in prison are still there until they are “brought out from the prison.” Like all of God’s Word, this is, was and will be true. It is not a statement which applied only to the days of Noah, nor does it apply only to the time of the death of Christ. These are the words of God, and they will never pass away:
Mat 24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.
Here again is a verse of those words which are, were, and always will be true:
Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
All who insist that angels married women in the day of Noah, are in essence saying that Christ’s words do pass away and are really only applicable or relevant to the time in which they were spoken. Nothing could be further from the truth. Truth is always true. Truth does not change to accommodate the times. Christ’s words are true, and they “will never pass away.” “Angels neither marry nor are given in marriage.”
How then, did Cain come to “be of that wicked one?” Cain came to be “of his father the devil” in the same way we all first come to be “of our Father the devil.” Will anyone contend that the “Jews that believed on Christ” were the product of angels marrying women? I should hope not, for there certainly is no such evidence in a physical way. Nevertheless, this is what Christ said of “those Jews which believed on Him, but who at the same time wanted Him dead:
Joh 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, [ then] are ye my disciples indeed;
Joh 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
“Free” from what? God’s truth brings us out of prison as captives:
Luk 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
Luk 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord [ is] upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
Luk 4:19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Luk 4:20 And he closed the book, and he gave [ it] again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.
Luk 4:21 And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.
Now look at what Christ has to say to these “Jews which believed on Him:”
Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Joh 8:45 And because I tell [ you] the truth, ye believe me not.
We are all “of our father the devil,” whenever we believe the lies he speaks “because there is no truth in him.” That is exactly had Cain came to be “the seed of the serpent.” Notice once more:
1Jn 3:12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother’s righteous.
Was Cain said to be “of that wicked one” because angels had physical sex with physical women? Absurd! Cain, just like each of us, was “a child of disobedience… because his own own works were evil.” Christ Himself said of Satan that he was “a murderer from the beginning.” Cain committed the very first murder “because his own works were evil.” That is what makes anyone “the seed of the serpent.” That is what makes each of us “the children of disobedience:
Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
So whether we are in the prison of the lies of “that wicked one, who was a murderer from the beginning”, or whether Satan himself is in either tartaroo or the abussos, it is all a matter of what is within us. Be sure to read the paper entitled Where and What Is The Bottomless Pit?
I hope this helps you to see that you cannot drag your friend to Christ, but if he asks you about your own understanding, I hope you yourself are willing to look into what the scriptures teach about spirits in prison and what the scriptures teach about angels which “neither marry nor are given in marriage.”
Your brother in Christ,
Mike
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